Marching onward with Centos...

[Dave Laird]

Good afternoon, everyone...

Hey, James, if you're listening in, follow my logic...

I've tried to do a floppy-based network install of Debian three or four
times, and to date, it hasn't once identified my network card, a NE2000,
and refused to let me install Debian over the network. Thinking it might
be the NIC, I installed Centos and it spotted the network card correctly
and installed over the network.

The minute I put the Debian CD in the drive, the installation goes fine,
including the detection of the network card. Is there something wrong on
the diskettes with the network installation, to your knowledge?

My "other" installation this weekend, Centos, is everything I described of
it last week. Even the graphic-based installation looks like the old
RedHat 9.0 installation, except with all the bugs removed, of course. ;-)
Granted, there are parts of the RedHat install that are missing from this
distribution, such as the Open Office Suite. What, you say. KDE without
Open Office? I think the reason for this is the Centos distribution is
more interested in capturing the server market, as that seems to be what
they have included-- all the server tools that once were available from
RedHat.

I'll be configuring and playing with Centos here shortly, as it installed
without incident on the same machine that the network card and Debian
seemed to be an issue.

Dave

[James Vahn]

Centos is an RPM distribution. I'm not sure if "marching onward" is
appropriate. Don't fall into a hole. ;-)

Post by Dave Laird
The minute I put the Debian CD in the drive, the installation goes fine,
including the detection of the network card. Is there something wrong on
the diskettes with the network installation, to your knowledge?

Are you current? There are 4 floppies here:

ftp://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/dists/sarge/main/installer-i386/current/\
images/floppy/


--

[Dave Laird]

Good evening, James!

Post by James Vahn
Centos is an RPM distribution. I'm not sure if "marching onward" is
appropriate. Don't fall into a hole. ;-)

What I'm trying to do is find something for all the abandoned Redhat
servers that, as of late, have come to me looking for an upgrade path that
absolutely will not break their Redhat tree structures. Thus far, after
testing on half a dozen different machines, I think I've found it. It is
RPM based, unfortunately, but has the latest of everything Redhat.

However, I've been running Debian behind the scenes, and I am, thus far,
impressed with the huge selection of applications, stuff I've never been
able to run before now.

Post by James Vahn

Post by Dave Laird
The minute I put the Debian CD in the drive, the installation goes fine,
including the detection of the network card. Is there something wrong on
the diskettes with the network installation, to your knowledge?

A rescue, a root and four driver diskettes here.

Post by James Vahn
ftp://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/dists/sarge/main/installer-i386/current/\
images/floppy/

I'll give that a try...

Dave

[James Vahn]

Post by Dave Laird
What I'm trying to do is find something for all the abandoned Redhat
servers that, as of late, have come to me looking for an upgrade path that
absolutely will not break their Redhat tree structures.

Do you mean things like named.conf? I think that was a recent example here.
Apparently Red Hat uses one big file, where Debian uses several. Also, isn't
that true for sendmail.cf ? Debian uses small m4 files to generate the cf
file. Last I looked, RedHat was still using the old method of hand editing
that thing. But these are bad examples, certainly not worth saving for their
Red Hat methods. I can't imagine things being that different though. It's all
pretty much the same software.

I think it has more to do with being comfortable. Nobody like to change.
You're looking for something just like RedHat that isn't RedHat, but I'll
bet you can't give me a single genuine example or technical reason. Yet
I'll bet you don't wear Nike tennis shoes. Ask someone who does, ask why
he wears them. You'll hear excuses just like the ones you're giving me. ;-)

Post by Dave Laird
Thus far, after testing on half a dozen different machines, I think I've
found it. It is RPM based, unfortunately, but has the latest of everything
Redhat.

But the latest of RedHat... Why is that good? They have been said to have a
*tiny* engineering staff, the marketing and legal departments carry more
in-house clout. You've said so yourself; library incompatibilities, etc.
That indicates poor, hurried packaging. That's why Fedora exists, to iron
out the bugs from their overpriced end-products, at comparatively little
cost to them. The only real thing RedHat has is brand name recognition. They
bought that with your money and someone elses work.

Post by Dave Laird
However, I've been running Debian behind the scenes, and I am, thus far,
impressed with the huge selection of applications, stuff I've never been
able to run before now.

All config files under /etc, usually /etc/<package>/, it's pretty easy to
take care of. Open standards all the way, nothing proprietary at all. They
get a little carried away at times, but you can add those bits in if they
are really needed. Like the $15 winmodem.deb I stuck on the laptop, or the
realplayer.rpm, or the microsoft-ttf.cab ..

Post by Dave Laird

Post by James Vahn
ftp://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/dists/sarge/main/installer-i386/current/\
images/floppy/

I'll give that a try...

Do 'em a favor, send any pitfalls to debian-***@lists.debian.org
It's an open mailing list, no need to subscribe. They want to get this
thing done next month.


--

[Dave Laird]

Good evening, again, James...

Post by James Vahn

Post by Dave Laird
What I'm trying to do is find something for all the abandoned Redhat
servers that, as of late, have come to me looking for an upgrade path
that absolutely will not break their Redhat tree structures.

Do you mean things like named.conf? I think that was a recent example
here. Apparently Red Hat uses one big file, where Debian uses several.
Also, isn't that true for sendmail.cf ? Debian uses small m4 files to
generate the cf file. Last I looked, RedHat was still using the old method
of hand editing that thing. But these are bad examples, certainly not
worth saving for their Red Hat methods. I can't imagine things being that
different though. It's all pretty much the same software.

I'll concede it is pretty much all the same software, based upon my
limited use of it. Until two months ago, I had never used Debian, and yet
I was able to build a desktop out of it, with minimal RTFM time, if any at
all. One week later, after a bit of dinking around, I built a Samba server
for behind a Client's firewall using Debian, and it works flawlessly. The
only thing which I had to acclimate myself with was the difference in the
rc. scripts.

Post by James Vahn
I think it has more to do with being comfortable. Nobody like to change.
You're looking for something just like RedHat that isn't RedHat, but I'll
bet you can't give me a single genuine example or technical reason. Yet

Nope, not a one. I want something that will allow me to continue their
existing networks with *minimal* effort on my part, because I don't have a
lot of disposable time these days. Debian is definitely a factor for
future development, simply because it is free and unemcumbered, and
because it has an excellent reputation for security, especially when an
IPTABLES firewall is judiciously deployed. ;-)

Post by James Vahn
But the latest of RedHat... Why is that good? They have been said to have
a *tiny* engineering staff, the marketing and legal departments carry more
in-house clout. You've said so yourself; library incompatibilities, etc.
That indicates poor, hurried packaging. That's why Fedora exists, to iron
out the bugs from their overpriced end-products, at comparatively little
cost to them. The only real thing RedHat has is brand name recognition.
They bought that with your money and someone elses work.

<chortle> You've been peeking again, James. Guilty on all counts, except I
never spent more than disk copying charges for Redhat. What I find
particularly gratifying about Centos is that it has all the high-end
server applications that Redhat's expensive Enterprise server option
contains, but at no charge. However, now that I have done a nose-to-nose
comparison of Redhat/Centos and Debian, you might be amused at the
collection of Debian CD's I have amassed from Cheapbytes. Kharma's current
server, which is RedHat 9.0, and thus cannot be updated via the typical
up2date application, will probably be extended out six months or more
using Centos, updated using yum. I don't like it, as such, for all the
reasons you have given above, and more, but rolling Redhat 9.0 over to
Debian is a bit more effort than I have the time to do right now.

Post by James Vahn

Post by Dave Laird
However, I've been running Debian behind the scenes, and I am, thus far,
impressed with the huge selection of applications, stuff I've never been
able to run before now.

All config files under /etc, usually /etc/<package>/, it's pretty easy to
take care of. Open standards all the way, nothing proprietary at all. They
get a little carried away at times, but you can add those bits in if they
are really needed. Like the $15 winmodem.deb I stuck on the laptop, or the
realplayer.rpm, or the microsoft-ttf.cab ..

I fondly point out the incredible ease with which I was able to initialize
and use my nefarious ATI TV card under Debian. It has been a public
embarrassment, all the various things I've had to do with RedHat/Mandrake
in order to get the TV cards working. Under Debian I did an ap-get or two,
installed the applications, and the kernel immediately picked up what I
was doing and the TV came on.

Post by James Vahn

Post by Dave Laird

Post by James Vahn
ftp://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/dists/sarge/main/installer-i386/current/\
images/floppy/

I'll give that a try...

It's an open mailing list, no need to subscribe. They want to get this
thing done next month.

They need more US mirrors, particularly on the west coast. The University
of Oregon and Berkeley are both pretty slow, but that is the same for
pretty much everyone these days. <sigh>

Dave
--
Dave Laird (***@kharma.net)
The Used Kharma Lot
Web Page: http://www.kharma.net updated 11/24/2004
Usenet news server : news://news.kharma.net

Fortune Random Thought For the Minute
There is only one word for aid that is genuinely without strings,
and that word is blackmail.
-- Colm Brogan

[Dave Laird]

Evening, James!

Most often you can find a script in /etc/defaults/<package> that enables
or disables, customizes things. They don't use multiple init levels,
although the feature is present and functioning. The network is under
/etc/network/ and the iptables firewall is /etc/rc.firewall

Just because I'm still having fits with the NIC cards, what is a
rock-solid network card to use with Debian? I had much the same problem
with using Tulip-based cards in RedHat, so I'm not terribly surprised that
Debian has fits with them too.

I was a hosts_access holdout for years, then moved to ipchains just as
iptables was coming into vogue. As of last month I began using iptables
by way of KDE's guarddog and guidedog. Point the thing at a portscanner
and let them have their way with it - http://www.pcflank.com/scanner1.htm

I tried nmap on the Debian box while it was still connected to the network
and the NIC card was functional. It actually was cleaner than my other KDE
workstation under Mandrake, which cracked me up. PLUS KDE under Debian
seems a lot faster than Mandrake. Don't know if that is factual or just
wishful thinking. 8-)

I'm currently downloading files needed for CD#1 using jigdo. Since I keep
all my updates (using apt-move) in a partial mirror, and the last CD#1,
jigdo managed to find all but 125 packages (about 500 of 'em) right here.
When it finishes, I'll have a sarge-i386-1.iso to burn and archive.

I really got a kick out of the facts that (1) Debian senses my TV card and
tuner, just fine. Sooner or later I'll find an application to run it, I
know. (2) There are a lot more applications than Mandrake admits will run
under KDE, including some nifty database stuff that I will put to work as
soon as I resolve the NIC card issues. (3) Since this is Woody, I may have
to see if it will upgrade to the latest version using apt-get. No? Time
for a bigger hard disk, then. 8-)

Post by Dave Laird
They need more US mirrors, particularly on the west coast. The University
of Oregon and Berkeley are both pretty slow, but that is the same for
pretty much everyone these days. <sigh>

There are 5 in the DNS, I must say 128.101.80.133 has been acting up
a bit lately. What I do is quit the download and restart, hoping the
DNS gives me another mirror.
All of these are donated. Beggars can't be choosers. :-)

I noticed with some alacrity that just earlier the University of Oregon
dropped completely off the map for awhile, but I hopped over to another
mirror and grabbed the seven CD's for Woody from there. Heck, other than
the NIC issue, which I think might be a picky NIC card, it's up and
running sans Open Office, which I can get from apt-get later when I'm
ready to rock. This is pretty cool. ;-)

Dave

[James Vahn]

Post by Dave Laird
Just because I'm still having fits with the NIC cards, what is a
rock-solid network card to use with Debian? I had much the same problem
with using Tulip-based cards in RedHat, so I'm not terribly surprised that
Debian has fits with them too.

I'm using a bottomshelf RealTek elcheapo, works fine. I was having some
troubles with the crossover cable a while back, thought it was something
more serious but fixed it with a small wad of paper. Transfer rates to
the laptop (National Semiconductor) are 2-3 MB/s, if I recall.

Try running "modconf" and pick the "ne" driver, tell it the port and IRQ.
Should work, just don't let it autodetect. I've used a variety of those
cards over the years.

Post by Dave Laird
soon as I resolve the NIC card issues. (3) Since this is Woody, I may have
to see if it will upgrade to the latest version using apt-get. No? Time
for a bigger hard disk, then. 8-)

Woody is really old. Point /etc/apt/sources.list to sarge, then run
apt-get update
apt-get dist-upgrade
apt-get clean

Try this for sources.list:

deb http://security.debian.org/ testing/updates main
deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian testing main contrib non-free
deb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/ unstable main
deb http://kplayer.sourceforge.net/ ./


--

[Dave Laird]

Good morning, James...

I should have known. It's another damned Netgear card, and it *is*
detecting the card correctly. It just doesn't have support for the F311
cards, I knew there was a reason why this box was sitting on the floor in
my office unused, and now I know why. <sigh>

Post by James Vahn
I'm using a bottomshelf RealTek elcheapo, works fine. I was having some
troubles with the crossover cable a while back, thought it was something
more serious but fixed it with a small wad of paper. Transfer rates to
the laptop (National Semiconductor) are 2-3 MB/s, if I recall.

I saw where Debian supports the RealTek cards. <huge grin> I had a plague
of those on various motherboards awhile back and got them working OK,
which surprised even ME.

Post by James Vahn
Try running "modconf" and pick the "ne" driver, tell it the port and IRQ.
Should work, just don't let it autodetect. I've used a variety of those
cards over the years.

Post by Dave Laird
soon as I resolve the NIC card issues. (3) Since this is Woody, I may
have to see if it will upgrade to the latest version using apt-get. No?
Time for a bigger hard disk, then. 8-)

Woody is really old. Point /etc/apt/sources.list to sarge, then run
apt-get update
apt-get dist-upgrade
apt-get clean

OOH! I've got to get a network card this morning. All I have are two
Netgears in the junk box and a Kingston card that probably was in the junk
box for a reason. ;-)

Post by James Vahn
deb http://security.debian.org/ testing/updates main
deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian testing main contrib non-free
deb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/ unstable main
deb http://kplayer.sourceforge.net/ ./

Cool. This will keep my afternoon busy, I can see. 8-) 8-)

Dave

[James Vahn]

Post by James Vahn
deb http://security.debian.org/ testing/updates main
deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian testing main contrib non-free
deb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/ unstable main
deb http://kplayer.sourceforge.net/ ./

deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian unstable main contrib non-free
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Add that line too, and this for an /etc/apt/preferences file:

Package: *
Pin: release a=unstable
Pin-Priority: 50

This would avoid a "dist-upgrade" to the entire unstable branch (though
people say it has more advantages than disadvantages), yet have those brand
spankin new packages in Sid at your fingertips.

For example, "apt-get install abiword -tunstable" would retrieve Abiword
version 2.2 and all its trimmings from Sid instead of Sarge. This is also
how security updates for Sarge HAD to be made, until recently.

Just be sure to refresh the list every once in awhile (apt-get update)
and after each edit of the sources.list

--

[Dave Laird]

Good morning, James...

Post by James Vahn
deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian unstable main contrib non-free
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Package: *
Pin: release a=unstable
Pin-Priority: 50

Done.

Post by James Vahn
Just be sure to refresh the list every once in awhile (apt-get update)
and after each edit of the sources.list

How often do YOU run apt-get update and do you run it as a cron job?

Dave

[James Vahn]

Post by Dave Laird

Post by James Vahn
Just be sure to refresh the list every once in awhile (apt-get update)
and after each edit of the sources.list

How often do YOU run apt-get update and do you run it as a cron job?

Every Wednesday. I figure the guys work mostly over the weekend and
that gives the files time to migrate.

Sometimes upgrade will stop and ask questions, and I don't want that in
cron, so I use the -d switch to "download only", then running it manually
when I have the time. If you want a GUI, try kpackage or synaptic.

The sister command to apt-get is apt-cache:

apt-cache search something
apt-cache show <package>

[James Vahn]

Dave Laird <***@kharma.net> wrote:

"Thu, 20 Jan 2005 04:19:31"

apt-cache show chrony
apt-get install chrony

Set the time/date manually and crony will keep it there.
The config file at /etc/chrony/chrony.conf is probably okay the
way it is, best to check though.



--

[James Vahn]

That's precisely what I did. I got my el-cheapo, new out of the box, and
installed it and configured it. PRESTO! The box is running, and as we
speak is downbloading something like 400+ packages as an upgrade.

So did it survive? What about KDE issues? Some doozies awhile back,
did it give you any trouble?



--

[Dave Laird]

Good evening, James...

Post by James Vahn
So did it survive? What about KDE issues? Some doozies awhile back,
did it give you any trouble?

Why of course, oh Ye of little faith. 8-)

I am just now finishing up the last download, this time Open Office, and
based largely upon what I have already seen, I think I will be migrating
my Mandrake box over to Debian within a few weeks, or perhaps a month. If
I didn't already have a project in progress using some libraries from
Mandrake I would probably jump tomorrow.

See? I even got my family fortunes in the .sig file up and running,
getting Jed was so simple it was funny, and other than getting the TV
working, things are moving along at a righteous pace. Although this is
really working this old box (A Pentium II 500) I can hardly wait to see it
run with a 2.8 G Duron in my main box. <evil smirk>

I am in love with the text-based apt-get update, though. I think, unless
you tell me otherwise, I can get it running as a cron job once or twice
a week, can't I? It looks as if it were made for scripting.

I'm sorry to say for Jack-in-the-Cave that the printer drivers used by
Cups are no better nor no worse than those for Mandrake, when it comes to
unsupported HP printers. However they DO have a wider coverage, so all is
not lost. 8)

Dave

[James Vahn]

Post by Dave Laird
I am just now finishing up the last download, this time Open Office, and
based largely upon what I have already seen, I think I will be migrating
my Mandrake box over to Debian within a few weeks, or perhaps a month. If
I didn't already have a project in progress using some libraries from
Mandrake I would probably jump tomorrow.

Amazing. Getting you to seriously try Debian is probably my greatest
lifetime achievement. ;-)

Btw, Openoffice is at 1.1.3 in Sid, 1.1.2 in Sarge.

Post by Dave Laird
I'm sorry to say for Jack-in-the-Cave that the printer drivers used by
Cups are no better nor no worse than those for Mandrake, when it comes to
unsupported HP printers. However they DO have a wider coverage, so all is
not lost. 8)

Yes, it pays to check the lists before buying, especially scanners and
printers. The stuff at http://linuxprinting.org is a bit out of date but
worth checking, maybe find a lead there.



--

[Dave Laird]

Good morning, James...

Post by James Vahn
Amazing. Getting you to seriously try Debian is probably my greatest
lifetime achievement. ;-)
Btw, Openoffice is at 1.1.3 in Sid, 1.1.2 in Sarge.

I tried Debian once before, as a server, but had some problems with SSL
that I didn't know how to fix, then. They've obviously done some work on
SSL in this version, as I didn't have a bit of trouble getting my key
recognized. However, I might not have tried it if I didn't have you
nipping at my heels. 8-)

Post by James Vahn

Post by Dave Laird
I'm sorry to say for Jack-in-the-Cave that the printer drivers used by
Cups are no better nor no worse than those for Mandrake, when it comes to
unsupported HP printers. However they DO have a wider coverage, so all is
not lost. 8)

Yes, it pays to check the lists before buying, especially scanners and
printers. The stuff at http://linuxprinting.org is a bit out of date but
worth checking, maybe find a lead there.

They are the only ones moving forward with an HP all-is-one solution for
printer/fax/scanner outfits. They finally have the printer drivers to
where they work, and I see steady progress on the Sane drivers, so I
expect it will come around shortly. Perhaps the fact that HP is now
claiming they support open source software suggests things will improve,
but I'm a great believer in show me first.

Dave

[James Vahn]

Post by Dave Laird
They are the only ones moving forward with an HP all-is-one solution for
printer/fax/scanner outfits. They finally have the printer drivers to
where they work, and I see steady progress on the Sane drivers, so I
expect it will come around shortly. Perhaps the fact that HP is now
claiming they support open source software suggests things will improve,
but I'm a great believer in show me first.

Is this any help? apt-cache show hpoj hpoj-xojpanel

Description: HP OfficeJet Linux driver (hpoj)
This software provides Linux support for most "multi-function" (also known
as "all-in-one") peripherals from Hewlett-Packard, including OfficeJet,
LaserJet, Printer/Scanner/Copier ("PSC"), and PhotoSmart printer products.

Description: HP OfficeJet Linux QT-based LCD panel display
This package provides a QT-based application that displays the contents of
the LCD panel for most "multi-function" (also known as "all-in-one")
peripherals from Hewlett-Packard, including OfficeJet, LaserJet,
Printer/Scanner/Copier ("PSC"), and PhotoSmart printer products.

They say "most" HP all-in-ones. Lemme guess which one Jack has..


--

[Dave Laird]

Good morning, James!

Post by James Vahn
Is this any help? apt-cache show hpoj hpoj-xojpanel

That's the one I've been following closely, as they seem to have fixed all
the various printer issues and are now starting on unifying Sane support
into their current drivers.

Post by James Vahn
Description: HP OfficeJet Linux driver (hpoj)
This software provides Linux support for most "multi-function" (also
known as "all-in-one") peripherals from Hewlett-Packard, including
OfficeJet, LaserJet, Printer/Scanner/Copier ("PSC"), and PhotoSmart
printer products.
Description: HP OfficeJet Linux QT-based LCD panel display
This package provides a QT-based application that displays the contents
of the LCD panel for most "multi-function" (also known as "all-in-one")
peripherals from Hewlett-Packard, including OfficeJet, LaserJet,
Printer/Scanner/Copier ("PSC"), and PhotoSmart printer products.
They say "most" HP all-in-ones. Lemme guess which one Jack has..

I believe it's called the HP 2140 SC, if my memory is right. However, the
same driver works for nearly ALL the HP all-is-one devices I've seen thus
far. What is almost funny is that Microsoft and HP have had to upgrade the
Windows color printer drivers *twice* in the last month when it couldn't
or wouldn't work as expected. At least the printer drivers under all Linux
flavors seems to work fine, now.

Dave

[James Vahn]

Post by Dave Laird

Post by James Vahn
They say "most" HP all-in-ones. Lemme guess which one Jack has..

I believe it's called the HP 2140 SC, if my memory is right.

An HP PSC 2410 perhaps? Staples has/had them for $285 or so, fine machine
that it is but I don't see anything support-wise for linux.


--

[Dave Laird]

Good morning, James...

Post by James Vahn
An HP PSC 2410 perhaps? Staples has/had them for $285 or so, fine machine
that it is but I don't see anything support-wise for linux.

That's it! A scanner/fax machine/printer/copier, all in one. It's not a
bad unit at all, but getting it to function in Linux-anything has been a
trial by fire, and I admit I'm only halfway there, now.

You have to really dig to find any support for this device, and even then,
a bit of compiling at the command line will be the only solution. I
certainly stumbled into a real mess when I agreed to help Jack with his
printer, as HP was taking the position this was originally supposed to be
a new generation of Windows-friendly printers, not to be used with any
other operating systems, but then, at the last minute, HP supposedly
joined the Open Source community and started shipping high-end Linux
workstations and including similar All-in-One printer devices with their
new products, some of which <GULP> didn't work any better than the
PSC-3410, either.

PRESTO! An entirely new division of HP burst out of the mud, for the
purpose of creating drivers and providing some limited support for those
who had purchased Linux products with HP printers. Unfortunately, the
support people were afraid of Linux in my opinion, and in fact, repeatedly
told me that their products do not require any knowledge of compilers or
other "techie" things. Then the engineers came up with a quasi-driver
using Cups, which at least allows the devices to utilize their full-color
technology. I've gotten that far, using the driver from linuxprinters.com
and several really knowledgeable engineers who are on the Cups
contributors list.

HP is actively working on a Sane driver, and they came up with a Gamma
about a week ago, which promptly locks up most Mandrake, Debian and RedHat
boxes with a malloc() error of some kind. They also have a driver for the
FAX, but I haven't had the time to truly explore it yet.

However, given the fact they have already spent several months on this
project, and the fact they finally got the Cups printer driver to where
you can make it work uploading a PSD file into your Cups directory (once
you have debugged and compiled it, that is), I may get Jack's scanner
working yet.

You *can* get them to work, but it requires holding your jaw in a certain
position for over several hours.

Dave
--
Dave Laird (***@kharma.net)
The Used Kharma Lot
Web Page: http://www.kharma.net updated 11/24/2004
Usenet news server : news://news.kharma.net

Fortune Random Thought For the Minute
Last time I had intimate contact with another human being was rather a
painful experience... I rather liked it... ;)
-- Brett Manz

[Jack Garrett]

Post by Dave Laird
Good afternoon, everyone...
Hey, James, if you're listening in, follow my logic...
I've tried to do a floppy-based network install of Debian three or four
times, and to date, it hasn't once identified my network card, a NE2000,
and refused to let me install Debian over the network. Thinking it might
be the NIC, I installed Centos and it spotted the network card correctly
and installed over the network.
The minute I put the Debian CD in the drive, the installation goes fine,
including the detection of the network card. Is there something wrong on
the diskettes with the network installation, to your knowledge?
My "other" installation this weekend, Centos, is everything I described of
it last week. Even the graphic-based installation looks like the old
RedHat 9.0 installation, except with all the bugs removed, of course. ;-)
Granted, there are parts of the RedHat install that are missing from this
distribution, such as the Open Office Suite. What, you say. KDE without
Open Office? I think the reason for this is the Centos distribution is
more interested in capturing the server market, as that seems to be what
they have included-- all the server tools that once were available from
RedHat.
I'll be configuring and playing with Centos here shortly, as it installed
without incident on the same machine that the network card and Debian
seemed to be an issue.
Dave

James keep Dave up to date on Debian I like what i see so far. My
kingdom for a Linux OS that will work a 250 zip drive correctly. The
printer scanner is another issue thats in hp's hands and soonner if not
later thay, I hope, will get it right.
Jack